Talk:Philip Abelson

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(William M. Connolley 19:25, 13 Nov 2004 (UTC)) http://www.oism.org/pproject/s33p333.htm

"Father of the Nuclear Submarine"

Rightly or wrongly, Hyman G. Rickover is thought by most| ^[1] ^[2] ^[3] to be the "Father of the Nuclear Submarine" as he is the person who pushed and struggled to make Abelson's concept a reality.

Google search on "Father+of+the+Nuclear+Submarine"+rickover 93 hits
Google search on "Father+of+the+Nuclear+Submarine"+abelson 19 unique hits

Google's hardly the reliable-source arbitrer of intellectual paternity, but I think it gives a measure of the relative differences in public opinion. In any event, rightly or wrongly, "Father of" statements are dubious honorifics more about media, PR, and public opinion, than some objective truth. Both men deserve significant places in naval reactor history, but on the PR front, I think Rickover is the "Father". he certainly had a lot more to do with the Nautilus' reactor than Abelson. --A. B. ^(talk) 16:53, 13 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

^ Jeffries, John (2001). Justice Lewis F. Powell, Jr. Fordham Univ Press. ISBN 0-8232-2110-5. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help), p.162: "'Admiral Rickover', said Powell, '"father of the atomic submarine", is a a great naval officer... It is not equally clear that he is a careful and thorough student of American education.'"
^ "Submarine Range Called Unlimited; Rickover Says Atomic Craft Can Cruise Under Ice To North Pole and Beyond," The New York Times, December 6, 1957, p.33: "The admiral, who is often called the 'Father of the Atomic Submarine'..."
^ Galantin, I. J. (1997). Submarine Admiral: From Battlewagons to Ballistic Missiles. University of Illinois Press. ISBN 0-252-06675-8. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help),p. 217: "Chet Holifield... member of the JCAE... said 'Of all the men I dealt with in public service, at least one will go down in history: Admiral Hyman G. Rickover, the father of the nuclear Navy.'"

See Talk:S-50 (Manhattan Project)

See Talk:S-50 (Manhattan Project) for a discussion of pre-Rickover navy nuclear work. There's probably some editorial research on that page that would help here and vice-versa.

The S-50 article was merged into K-25, but the S-50 talk page remains. The S-50 article will probably get resurrected soon. --A. B. ^(talk) 17:10, 13 December 2006 (UTC)[reply]

Ideation & Creation

Abelson certainly deserves the current credit he is receiving for creating an appropriate reactor design and fostering the notion of a nuclear-powered submarine, but make no mistake: Rickover was without question the driving force that made these ideas real. He was the deliberately chosen, highly determined bull-in-a-china-closet that brought the thought into reality.

See what the military head of the Manhattan Project, Leslie R. Groves, said on this point here.

Another great read: a 1954 Time Magazine cover story on Rickover's role. --24.28.6.209 13:58, 8 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

P.S. Couple of additional points to ponder in this philosophical discussion:

What fate for Abelson (in terms of "fatherhood") if Rickover had chosen a different design (and there were several to choose from...witness USS Seawolf, the 2nd nuclear submarine) for Nautilus? Without any doubt whatsoever, this was absolutely Rickover's choice to make.

Many years ago, I had the clear idea of a TV channel that would be dedicated to music videos. Does that make me the father of MTV? (I hope not...!) --24.28.6.209 14:06, 8 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Added link today regarding Ross Gunn, who both preceded and led Abelson in developing nuclear submarine concepts. Abelson is certainly *not* the Father of Nuclear Submarines. An honest man, I very much doubt he would welcome the title.--24.28.6.209 02:11, 13 July 2007 (UTC)[reply]

WikiProject class rating

This article was automatically assessed because at least one WikiProject had rated the article as start, and the rating on other projects was brought up to start class. BetacommandBot 10:01, 10 November 2007 (UTC)[reply]

Break into sections

The current article is a single narrative, but it's getting long and contains a lot of different themes. I suggest breaking off an "opinions" section. Abelson had a lot of opinions and I think they are fairly cohesive, and to some degree distinct from the rest of his professional and academic work...enough that I think we could improve the readability of the article by putting such things in a separate section. Thoughts? Cazort (talk) 18:28, 6 January 2009 (UTC)[reply]

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[1] Jeffries, John (2001). Justice Lewis F. Powell, Jr. Fordham Univ Press. ISBN 0-8232-2110-5. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help), p.162: "'Admiral Rickover', said Powell, '"father of the atomic submarine", is a a great naval officer... It is not equally clear that he is a careful and thorough student of American education.'"

[2] "Submarine Range Called Unlimited; Rickover Says Atomic Craft Can Cruise Under Ice To North Pole and Beyond," The New York Times, December 6, 1957, p.33: "The admiral, who is often called the 'Father of the Atomic Submarine'..."

[3] Galantin, I. J. (1997). Submarine Admiral: From Battlewagons to Ballistic Missiles. University of Illinois Press. ISBN 0-252-06675-8. {{cite book}}: Cite has empty unknown parameter: |coauthors= (help),p. 217: "Chet Holifield... member of the JCAE... said 'Of all the men I dealt with in public service, at least one will go down in history: Admiral Hyman G. Rickover, the father of the nuclear Navy.'"

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