Wikipedia:Deletion review
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Deletion review (DRV) is for reviewing speedy deletions and outcomes of deletion discussions. This includes appeals to delete pages kept after a prior discussion.
If you are considering a request for a deletion review, please read the "Purpose" section below to make sure that is what you wish to do. Then, follow the instructions below.
Purpose
Deletion review may be used:
- if someone believes the closer of a deletion discussion interpreted the consensus incorrectly;
- if a speedy deletion was done outside of the criteria or is otherwise disputed;
- if significant new information has come to light since a deletion that would justify recreating the deleted page;
- if a page has been wrongly deleted with no way to tell what exactly was deleted; or
- if there were substantial procedural errors in the deletion discussion or speedy deletion.
Deletion review should not be used:
- because of a disagreement with the deletion discussion's outcome that does not involve the closer's judgment (a page may be renominated after a reasonable timeframe);
- (This point formerly required first consulting the deleting admin if possible. As per this discussion an editor is not required to consult the closer of a deletion discussion (or the deleting admin for a speedy deletion) before starting a deletion review. However doing so is good practice, and can often save time and effort for all concerned. Notifying the closer is required.)
- to point out other pages that have or have not been deleted (as each page is different and stands or falls on its own merits);
- to challenge an article's deletion via the proposed deletion process, or to have the history of a deleted page restored behind a new, improved version of the page, called a history-only undeletion (please go to Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion for these);
- to repeat arguments already made in the deletion discussion;
- to argue technicalities (such as a deletion discussion being closed ten minutes early);
- to request that previously deleted content be used on other pages (please go to Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion for these requests);
- to attack other editors, cast aspersions, or make accusations of bias (such requests may be speedily closed);
- for uncontroversial undeletions, such as undeleting a very old article where substantial new sources have subsequently arisen. Use Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion instead. (If any editor objects to the undeletion, then it is considered controversial and this forum may be used.)
- to ask for permission to write a new version of a page which was deleted, unless it has been protected against creation. In general you don't need anyone's permission to recreate a deleted page, and if your new version does not qualify for deletion then it will not be deleted.
Copyright violating, libelous, or otherwise prohibited content will not be restored.
Instructions
Before listing a review request, please:
- Consider attempting to discuss the matter with the closer as this could resolve the matter more quickly. There could have been a mistake, miscommunication, or misunderstanding, and a full review may not be needed. Such discussion also gives the closer the opportunity to clarify the reasoning behind a decision.
- Check that it is not on the list of perennial requests. Repeated requests every time some new, tiny snippet appears on the web have a tendency to be counter-productive. It is almost always best to play the waiting game unless you can decisively overcome the issues identified at deletion.
Steps to list a new deletion review
 | If your request is completely non-controversial (e.g., restoring an article deleted with a PROD, restoring an image deleted for lack of adequate licensing information, asking that the history be emailed to you, etc), please use Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion instead. |
| 1. |
and paste the template skeleton at the top of the discussions (but not at the top of the page). Then fill in {{subst:drv2
|page=File:Foo.png
|xfd_page=Wikipedia:Files for deletion/2009 February 19#Foo.png
|article=Foo
|reason=
}} ~~~~
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| 2. |
Inform the editor who closed the deletion discussion by adding the following on their user talk page:
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| 3. |
For nominations to overturn and delete a page previously kept, attach |
| 4. |
Leave notice of the deletion review outside of and above the original deletion discussion:
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Commenting in a deletion review
Any editor may express their opinion about an article or file being considered for deletion review. In the deletion review discussion, please type one of the following opinions preceded by an asterisk (*) and surrounded by three apostrophes (''') on either side. If you have additional thoughts to share, you may type this after the opinion. Place four tildes (~~~~) at the end of your entry, which should be placed below the entries of any previous editors:
- Endorse the original closing decision; or
- Relist on the relevant deletion forum (usually Articles for deletion); or
- List, if the page was speedy deleted outside of the established criteria and you believe it needs a full discussion at the appropriate forum to decide if it should be deleted; or
- Overturn the original decision and optionally an (action) per the Guide to deletion. For a keep decision, the default action associated with overturning is delete and vice versa. If an editor desires some action other than the default, they should make this clear; or
- Allow recreation of the page if new information is presented and deemed sufficient to permit recreation.
Examples of opinions for an article that had been deleted:
- *'''Endorse''' The original closing decision looks like it was sound, no reason shown here to overturn it. ~~~~
- *'''Relist''' A new discussion at AfD should bring a more thorough discussion, given the new information shown here. ~~~~
- *'''Allow recreation''' The new information provided looks like it justifies recreation of the article from scratch if there is anyone willing to do the work. ~~~~
- *'''List''' Article was speedied without discussion, criteria given did not match the problem, full discussion at AfD looks warranted. ~~~~
- *'''Overturn and merge''' The article is a content fork, should have been merged into existing article on this topic rather than deleted. ~~~~
- *'''Overturn and userfy''' Needs more development in userspace before being published again, but the subject meets our notability criteria. ~~~~
- *'''Overturn''' Original deletion decision was not consistent with current policies. ~~~~
Remember that deletion review is not an opportunity to (re-)express your opinion on the content in question. It is an opportunity to correct errors in process (in the absence of significant new information), and thus the action specified should be the editor's feeling of the correct interpretation of the debate. Deletion review is facilitated by succinct discussions of policies and guidelines; long or repeated arguments are not generally helpful. Rather, editors should set out the key policies and guidelines supporting their preferred outcome.
The presentation of new information about the content should be prefaced by Relist, rather than Overturn and (action). This information can then be more fully evaluated in its proper deletion discussion forum. Allow recreation is an alternative in such cases.
Temporary undeletion
Admins participating in deletion reviews are routinely requested to restore deleted pages under review and replace the content with the {{TempUndelete}} template, leaving the history for review by everyone. However, copyright violations and violations of the policy on biographies of living persons should not be restored.
Closing reviews
A nominated page should remain on deletion review for at least seven days, unless the nomination was a proposed deletion. After seven days, an administrator will determine whether a consensus exists. If that consensus is to undelete, the admin should follow the instructions at Wikipedia:Deletion review/Administrator instructions. If the consensus was to relist, the page should be relisted at the appropriate forum. If the consensus was that the deletion was endorsed, the discussion should be closed with the consensus documented.
If the administrator closes the deletion review as no consensus, the outcome should generally be the same as if the decision was endorsed. However:
- If the decision under appeal was a speedy deletion, the page(s) in question should be restored, as it indicates the deletion was not uncontroversial. The closer, or any editor, may then proceed to nominate the page at the appropriate deletion discussion forum, if they so choose.
- If the decision under appeal was an XfD close, the closer may, at their discretion, relist the page(s) at the relevant XfD.
Ideally all closes should be made by an administrator to ensure that what is effectively the final appeal is applied consistently and fairly but in cases where the outcome is patently obvious or where a discussion has not been closed in good time it is permissible for a non-admin (ideally a DRV regular) to close discussions. Non-consensus closes should be avoided by non-admins unless they are absolutely unavoidable and the closer is sufficiently experienced at DRV to make that call. (Hint: if you are not sure that you have enough DRV experience then you don't.)
Speedy closes
- Objections to a proposed deletion can be processed immediately as though they were a request at Wikipedia:Requests for undeletion
- Where the closer of a deletion discussion realizes their close was wrong, and nobody has endorsed, the closer may speedily close as overturn. They should fully reverse their close, restoring any deleted pages if appropriate.
- Where the nominator of a DRV wishes to withdraw their nomination, and nobody else has recommended any outcome other than endorse, the nominator may speedily close as "endorse" (or ask someone else to do so on their behalf).
- Certain discussions may be closed without result if there is no prospect of success (e.g. disruptive or sockpuppet nominations, if the nominator is repeatedly nominating the same page, or the page is listed at WP:DEEPER). These will usually be marked as "administrative close".
- Alexander Tetelbaum (talk|edit|history|logs|links|watch) (restore)
- I ask you to consider restoring the page "Alexander Tetelbaum" as being deleted without fair justification by Diannaa.
- Initially, the reason for deletion was that the page had infringed Amazon copyrights. Namely, had an image and text about the book "Executive Director". The page never had this staff--only a reference to the book.
- Later, Diannaa changed the reason and stated the similarities between the page and Amazon's Author BIO. Yes, the two BIO's are similar and it must be expected--if they had been different it would mean that one of them or both are incorrect. Also, this BIO is not the property of Amazon and got into Amazon about 15 years later than was published in Wikipedia.
- Also, Dianna questioned notability. Alexander Tetelbaum was the founding President of the first Jewish University in Ukraine, the author of 20 books, and dozens more achievements.
- It took 5 seconds to delete the page and now Dianna suggested resubmitting the page--and this is 40-50 hours of work. There is also a difference in that the original page was created in 2007 vs. a possible new one.
- This does not look right when one person can make such decisions and constantly change the reason for deletion. In case of resubmission, it can be also rejected taking into account that we are not happy with how Dianna handled this issue and we are afraid of retaliation.
- I honestly do not see any serious arguments to remove the page with 17 history, fully true, and all facts are supported by multiple references. I do not want to speculate, but the page was deleted soon after Dr. Tetelbaum published his book "Executive Director" which had some criticism of Wikipedia. Also, he recently published a joke on X and Truth websites where Wikipedia was mentioned among other organizations.
- To conclude, I ask you to restore the page and if you see any issues, we will fix them. Thanks for your consideration.
- Respectfully, Natalie Heroux (nheroux) Nheroux (talk) 18:57, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
The editor couldn't figure out how to post here, so I have copied the above from my talk page at her request. Diannaa (talk) 19:42, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
- I can't check the old version, but copyright violation is one of if not the most serious reason to delete a page on Wikipedia, and Diannaa is one of the most experienced users here with dealing with copyvios. If the person is notable, there is nothing preventing you from starting a new version which does not copy text from anywhere else - and yes, it could be rejected for various reasons, but not liking the content is not one of those reasons. SportingFlyer T·C 20:25, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
- Nheroux appears to have misunderstood some of the things that I did. The deletion was triggered by a report at CopyPatrol for the book "Executive Director" Book, where all the content was a match for content present at Amazon. After redirecting this to the author article Alexander Tetelbaum I noticed that everything in the author's article was a match for content present at Amazon as well. Since Amazon's webpages are not archived in the Wayback Machine there's no way to confirm whether or the content at Amazon was copied from Wikipedia or the other way around. So absent that proof, I decided that the author's article should be deleted as well. I never changed the reason for deletion; I noted from the start that the article was a match for the content at Amazon, noting "foundational copyvio, copied from Amazon" in my deletion rationale. I suggested that a new article could be started in draftspace. Diannaa (talk) 20:45, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
Inscurtible explanation given upon close, was not able to extract a sufficient explanation from the closer on their talk page so here we are (please excuse if there are errors in the formatting, I am a regular at deletion discussions but a novice at contesting them) Horse Eye's Back (talk) 22:36, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse. Once you discard the non-P&G-based !votes, you're left with no quorum to take any action, let alone consensus to do so. Merge and Redirect are great alternatives to deletion, but in the absence of consensus against keeping the article, they are not valid alternatives to retention. Closing that AfD as anything other than no-consensus would have been a supervote. I also commend Asilvering for their patience and civility in the face of incessant bludgeoning by the appellant on their Talk page. Owen× ☎ 23:47, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
- @OwenX: can you explain how a redirect is an alternative to deletion not a type of deletion? Often after I see a discussion closed as delete the page is turned into a redirect, is that not supposed to happen? Note that the substance of the redirect vote is "No compelling reason that it should exist." which leaves me to wonder how three editors (myself, Conyo14, and Geschichte) don't make a quorum opposed to retention. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 23:51, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
No compelling reason that it should exist
is not a P&G-based argument against retention, and Conyo14 didn't even argue for deletion. One !vote isn't quorum. Owen× ☎ 00:06, 11 November 2024 (UTC)- They seem to argue that it lacks sufficient coverage to be kept. Nobody found more sources, so they're saying it doesn't meet GNG. Wikipedia:QUORUM seems to be met. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 00:29, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- They said nothing of the sort. You are trying to ascribe your own views to them. Neither you nor the closing admin is a mind-reader. Let's stick to what was actually said there. Owen× ☎ 01:10, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- "but nevertheless the article might not maintain WP:GNG." followed by "I mean I've only found the one source" (indicating that they have not been able to establish that the article meets GNG) and you didn't address the point about QUORUM. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 01:48, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Nothing of WP:QUORUM is met, apart from the fact no one ever tried to PROD it. Someone opposed deletion and the AfD had decent participation. QUORUM is for instances where there's an AfD with little to no participation outside of the nominator. SportingFlyer T·C 02:13, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- You guys need to get on the same page, OwenX's entire argument is based on quorum applying. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 02:33, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- No, their argument isn't. They're saying not enough people agreed to delete this in order to have an alternative result to "no consensus." They are not quoting the Wikipedia policy on poorly attended AfDs. SportingFlyer T·C 02:44, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Since when do you need more than one person to agree if there are no policy or guideline based arguments that disagree? What quorum is that then and where is it written down? Horse Eye's Back (talk) 03:48, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- You're asking the closer to conclude your interpretation of the AfD is the only correct interpretation, which is not how the AfD process works. Given the nature of that discussion, a delete close would clearly be a WP:SUPERVOTE, especially considering no one else specifically agreed with you. SportingFlyer T·C 20:03, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Right now I'm asking where I can find this claim about quorum written down. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 07:36, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- You're asking the closer to conclude your interpretation of the AfD is the only correct interpretation, which is not how the AfD process works. Given the nature of that discussion, a delete close would clearly be a WP:SUPERVOTE, especially considering no one else specifically agreed with you. SportingFlyer T·C 20:03, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Since when do you need more than one person to agree if there are no policy or guideline based arguments that disagree? What quorum is that then and where is it written down? Horse Eye's Back (talk) 03:48, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- No, their argument isn't. They're saying not enough people agreed to delete this in order to have an alternative result to "no consensus." They are not quoting the Wikipedia policy on poorly attended AfDs. SportingFlyer T·C 02:44, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- You guys need to get on the same page, OwenX's entire argument is based on quorum applying. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 02:33, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Nothing of WP:QUORUM is met, apart from the fact no one ever tried to PROD it. Someone opposed deletion and the AfD had decent participation. QUORUM is for instances where there's an AfD with little to no participation outside of the nominator. SportingFlyer T·C 02:13, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- "but nevertheless the article might not maintain WP:GNG." followed by "I mean I've only found the one source" (indicating that they have not been able to establish that the article meets GNG) and you didn't address the point about QUORUM. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 01:48, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- They said nothing of the sort. You are trying to ascribe your own views to them. Neither you nor the closing admin is a mind-reader. Let's stick to what was actually said there. Owen× ☎ 01:10, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- They seem to argue that it lacks sufficient coverage to be kept. Nobody found more sources, so they're saying it doesn't meet GNG. Wikipedia:QUORUM seems to be met. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 00:29, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse I don't see any other way this could have been closed, honestly. Furthermore, reading the closer's talk page, you were able to extract a sufficient explanation from the closer. Trying to claim this should be overturned for not getting a sufficient explanation is not only not a reason to overturn a close, it's wrong on its face. SportingFlyer T·C 00:09, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse No correct deletion rationale was articulated. SKCRIT#3 applied the entire time, as "not participating in the war" is not a rationale supporting "not notable" which would, if true, be a rational reason for deletion. Really, it would be nice if some of our new admins could go around patrolling AfD for similar inadequate rationales and just closing the discussions (even NPASR, although I think RENOM's waiting period is an appropriate consequence to discourage frivolous nominations) so as to not waste time. Even if "NN" was a valid standalone rationale, no BEFORE was described--again, lack of effort on the nominator putting a greater burden on everyone else in the process. Disappointing all the way around. Jclemens (talk) 04:39, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse Two wanted to delete it, two wanted to keep it, one said redirect it, another said merge it, and one didn't vote at all. No consensus to delete. Dream Focus 05:43, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse close as no consensus. Not seeing a consensus to do anything emerging in this AfD after two relistings, and I can't see how it could have been closed differently. Espresso Addict (talk) 08:25, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse. There is a numerical majority to not keep the article (4 delete/WP:ATD vs. 2 keep), however there were no compelling, policy-based arguments to delete or even merge. No consensus was certainly a viable option and possibly the best option. As the closing admin stated, a merge discussion can be held at the article's talk page. Frank Anchor 14:02, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Since when is a lack of significant coverage in reliable sources not a compelling policy-based argument to delete? Horse Eye's Back (talk) 15:51, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- No proponent of delete/merge made the argument that there was a lack of significant coverage, so such an argument can not be considered. The arguments made were
I don’t think this is notable
in the nom statement,No compelling reason that it should exist
without any justification in Geschichte's redirect vote, a somewhat-valid WP:NOPAGE argument by Buckshot06, stating that the equipment can be listed in an already-existing list article, and a delete argument that explains there is no policy-based reason to keep the article but fails to make a policy-based argument to not keep it. Frank Anchor 16:17, 11 November 2024 (UTC)- How is that not a policy-based argument to not keep it? No reason to keep is a reason to delete because not being notable is the default, demonstrating that it is notable is the responsibility of those arguing for notability (and is generally accomplished by providing in-depth coverage in independent reliable sources) and they failed at that. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 16:21, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- You have the burden of proof backwards. We have DEL#REASON, not KEEP#REASON. Jclemens (talk) 03:57, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- WP:N says: "Article and list topics must be notable, or "worthy of notice"" Horse Eye's Back (talk) 07:35, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- There are plenty of arguments against notability. None of them were made in the AfD. Not that we're a court or anything, but you can't raise an issue on appeal that should have been argued, but wasn't, in the prior proceeding. Closers are to evaluate the arguments made, not the arguments that should, could, or might have been made. Jclemens (talk) 07:46, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- I clearly see that there is endorsement for the close (although the grounds appear to differ as they normally do), for my own education could you please explain how the plain reading of WP:N is incorrect and there is no burden to demonstrate notability. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 07:51, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- The burden is on those who recommend deletion to show that this action is the right action. Articles existing is the stable equilibrium. You need to introduce force to the system to get something moving. The force is the argument that there is a reason to delete, and if the specific variant of that argument is that a list topic is non-notable, the arguments needs to explain that the necessary conditions for notability weren't fulfilled. —Alalch E. 09:57, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- I clearly see that there is endorsement for the close (although the grounds appear to differ as they normally do), for my own education could you please explain how the plain reading of WP:N is incorrect and there is no burden to demonstrate notability. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 07:51, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- There are plenty of arguments against notability. None of them were made in the AfD. Not that we're a court or anything, but you can't raise an issue on appeal that should have been argued, but wasn't, in the prior proceeding. Closers are to evaluate the arguments made, not the arguments that should, could, or might have been made. Jclemens (talk) 07:46, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- WP:N says: "Article and list topics must be notable, or "worthy of notice"" Horse Eye's Back (talk) 07:35, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- You have the burden of proof backwards. We have DEL#REASON, not KEEP#REASON. Jclemens (talk) 03:57, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- How is that not a policy-based argument to not keep it? No reason to keep is a reason to delete because not being notable is the default, demonstrating that it is notable is the responsibility of those arguing for notability (and is generally accomplished by providing in-depth coverage in independent reliable sources) and they failed at that. Horse Eye's Back (talk) 16:21, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- That's what those before you should have said but didn't, and you didn't notice that they hadn't said it, and then you didn't say it either, meaning that no one said the only thing that needs to be said. —Alalch E. 07:06, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- Actually, now I see that you did say
I have not been able to locate any independent significant coverage of the topic and there is none on the page, so unless I'm missing something it doesn't meet the requirements of a stand alone list
, which is a fine argument. —Alalch E. 10:28, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- Actually, now I see that you did say
- No proponent of delete/merge made the argument that there was a lack of significant coverage, so such an argument can not be considered. The arguments made were
- Since when is a lack of significant coverage in reliable sources not a compelling policy-based argument to delete? Horse Eye's Back (talk) 15:51, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- comment FWIW, I was able to scrute the closer's reasoning on his talk page just fine.-- Deepfriedokra (talk) 14:59, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse - Sometimes when the arguments for both keeping and deleting are inscrutable, there really is No Consensus. Robert McClenon (talk) 20:37, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse.
If you think it's appropriate to close an AfD with two keep votes, a redirect, a merge, and only a single affirmation for deletion as anything other than "no consensus", you're welcome to take it to WP:DRV for a sanity check" from the talk page
(from the talk page)—bad explanation. That is not why there was no consensus.There was no consensus because we don't know why the page should be deleted.Should it be deleted ... because Turkey hardly participated in WW2 ... but it did, kind of? Comments like:I don’t think this is notable
,No compelling reason that it should exist
, orThere is currently no policy or guideline based argument for keeping the article
don't contain enough information about why the page should be deleted.Edit: I am striking a part of my comment, as my assessment of this discussion has changed after finally reading Horse Eye's Back's comment under the nomination (sorry for missing it the first time). This could have been closed as redirect. I can't advocate overturning because a no consensus close was still reasonable and under discretion. I disagree with many statements that underpin and endorse this particular close, and what I don't agree the most with is the mention of "quorum" (... I'm starting to gripe about this, I'm aware) —Alalch E. 07:03, 12 November 2024 (UTC)- By all means, how many valid, P&G-based Delete !votes do you see in that AfD? I see one. That would not normally be sufficient for a closing admin to take action, unless it was unopposed, which wasn't the case here. Quorum, like consensus, isn't based on counting noses, but on weighing P&G-based arguments. If an argument like "No reason to keep this" doesn't count towards consensus, it doesn't count towards quorum either. With one legitimate !vote to delete, the best we can do with this AfD is treat it as a contested PROD. Owen× ☎ 18:06, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
2024 Duki coal mine attack (closed)
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| The following is an archived debate of the deletion review of the page above. Please do not modify it. |
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Firstly, AfD is not the right forum for MERGE or REDIRECT discussion. Let me also remind that it's WP:NOTAVOTE. Secondly, the over a dozen references within the article itself assert notability while fulfilling and meeting the WP:GEOSCOPE, WP:DIVERSE and WP:NCRIME criteria of WP:NEVENT which reads:
Thirdly, at the expense of being called out for WP:OTHERSTUFFEXISTS, I'll still say that having articles on street brawl and stabbing incidents in the West but not one on a terrorist incident that occurred outside of an active warzone in the Global South is a pure example of WP:GEOBIAS. — Mister Banker (talk) 19:24, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
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| The above is an archive of the deletion review of the page listed in the heading. Please do not modify it. |
Non-admin closure with no reason stated other than "the result was keep." Attempted to discuss but was told to come to DRV. Relisting admin requested a source analysis which was then done and discussed between editors. Would feel more comfortable with an admin closure as the debate is about interpretation of WP:NMUSICIAN, with keep votes claiming an award is sufficient for notability. CNMall41 (talk) 21:13, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse. Not a WP:BADNAC. The AfD nominator expressed disagreement with many keep !votes, so there was some contention, but that's about it. The close is inherently non-controversial because the discussion could not have been closed any other way, obviously. An explanatory closer statement is not required, and that should not be a reason to overturn a non-admin closure.—Alalch E. 23:37, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse This is a clear instance of you making your case but it failing to convince any other members of the community. * Pppery * it has begun... 00:48, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse - Sometimes "the result was keep" is an explanatory close statement, and this is such a case. Robert McClenon (talk) 02:37, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse Just because the nominator says a lot, doesn't mean a close is contentious, nuanced, or needs an admin. Jclemens (talk) 03:19, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse I feel like I will yell WP:BADNAC more often than most people, but even though I would not have closed this as a non-admin myself, the close is so obviously a keep that WP:BADNAC does not apply. SportingFlyer T·C 04:15, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse overwhelming consensus to keep and overwhelming rejection of CNMall41’s source analysis, despite CNMall41’s attempts to WP:BLUDGEON the process. This seems like a fine NAC and there is no requirement for an in-depth closing statement. Frank Anchor 04:29, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse. At worst, it could be changed to “Weak Keep”, but not “no consensus”. Good close. If you don’t like the outcome, read advice at WP:RENOM. SmokeyJoe (talk) 10:44, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- IMO "Weak keep" is more often a !vote. I don't recall seeing it as an outcome; have I been missing these as closes? Jclemens (talk) 23:32, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
- I don't remember ever seeing an explicit "weak keep." I've certainly seen keeps where the closer has noted that it was just enough to be a keep, but that's different from a "weak keep." SportingFlyer T·C 01:55, 10 November 2024 (UTC)
- I was just struggling for words. It was not an emphatic keep, but it was a keep, definitely a keep. SmokeyJoe (talk) 09:37, 11 November 2024 (UTC)
- IMO "Weak keep" is more often a !vote. I don't recall seeing it as an outcome; have I been missing these as closes? Jclemens (talk) 23:32, 9 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse. Deletion review handles cases where a closer has failed to follow deletion process. It is not for cases where the deletion process was followed correctly but you do not like the decision that was arrived at. Stifle (talk) 10:55, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse: There is a clear consensus to keep here. CNMall41 seems not to be satisfied with the outcome and that is fine but that’s not what DRV is for. Best, Reading Beans, Duke of Rivia 10:57, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
Rob Yundt (closed)
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| The following is an archived debate of the deletion review of the page above. Please do not modify it. |
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Circumstances have changed. Yundt entered politics and is now a state senator-elect (see here and here), which is normally a clear enough basis for notability. A proactive approach of restoring the deleted article and allowing it to be worked on before he takes office is preferable to the standard practice of letting deleted revisions stay deleted and recreating a vastly inferior new article at some random point in the future. RadioKAOS / Talk to me, Billy / Transmissions 15:00, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
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| The above is an archive of the deletion review of the page listed in the heading. Please do not modify it. |
- People's Republic of China's civilian motor vehicle license plate (talk|edit|history|logs|links|watch) (XfD|restore)
The nominator claims this is a fork, but as was explained and unchallenged on the talk page, it is a subarticle. The nom does not seem to have noticed that explanation or the discussion at all. There may be a valid argument that some content should be merged somewhere, but probably from the parent article to this subarticle. Given rather minimal participation, I'd suggest this is at the very least relisted; if I was pinged (I was the one who commented and restored this before; I wasn't) I'd have voted to keep, and the result would likely be no consensus or a relist. Piotr Konieczny aka Prokonsul Piotrus| reply here 02:36, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Well, we didn't have any participants arguing to Keep this article which is one reason why I didn't relist this discussion. It's possible that relisting could have resulted in a different outcome but based on the participation in this discussion after a week, opinion didn't seem to be divided enough to warrant a relisting. Liz Read! Talk! 02:54, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Relist minimal participation, clear argument for keeping made in the DRV, relisting is easily done. SportingFlyer T·C 06:15, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse-ish if the argument had been deletion, there would have likely been enough consensus to do so. Three participants with a nomination suggesting redirection, one delete, and one merge/redirect is not a sufficiently anemic participation that we can assume consensus is invalid. But that brings us back to the question of how long and what sort of editing it would take to un-redirect an AfD-mandated redirect. What's the process for doing that other than DRV? I don't know that we have one. Jclemens (talk) 06:26, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse as the natural outcome in that AfD. Yes, zh-wiki, with their different guidelines and conventions, has a separate article on this. Is that a reason to fork it here? Relisting seems like a waste of time, but if that's what is needed to convey a sense of broader consensus, so be it. Owen× ☎ 09:46, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
Weak endorseNeutral there is consensus to not keep the article. With a split opinion between delete and a WP:ATD, the latter is usually the preferred option. However, I consider relisting to be a valid option as well based on the DRV nom statement and somewhat limited participation in the AFD.Frank Anchor 14:28, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Removing my weak endorsement. Generally when the DRV is significantly longer than the AFD, it is likely that is more that can be discussed at the AFD. I do believe the close was correct but a relist can be useful in this case. Frank Anchor 18:57, 13 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse. Editors agreed around "Most of the content here duplicates". It is possible to restore the article so that the content does not duplicate.—Alalch E. 15:17, 6 November 2024 (UTC)
- Relist to allow User:Piotrus to argue his point. SmokeyJoe (talk) 10:50, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Endorse as a valid reading of consensus. It should of course be noted that redirection is not deletion and should there be sufficient content to support an independent article it can be spun out upon reaching consensus at the talk page or by application of WP:BB. Stifle (talk) 10:56, 7 November 2024 (UTC)
- Just wanted to point out that People's Republic of China's civilian motor vehicle license plate that you have listed here has only two edits and has never been the subject of an AFD discussion. Piotrus, I think you meant People's Republic of China's civilian motor vehicle license plates. The whole content history is there beneath the redirect should you wish to access it. Liz Read! Talk! 03:04, 8 November 2024 (UTC)
- relist per SportingFlyer and SmokeyJoe. Participation was minimal and so I'd treat this much like a softdelete. Hobit (talk) 05:54, 12 November 2024 (UTC)
- (None at this time)